Follow Along New PoF Follow Along – Mature Dating

Follow Along New PoF Follow Along – Mature Dating

OK, so this is my 1st follow along

I thought I would post this campaign as I launched a couple of weeks back without any success and have since paused it, but as I’ve had a couple of conversions I thought it has life in it and know that if I can get some volume and increase the ctr I would then be able to profit, so looking for a little advice please from our resident PoF experts.

So to some targeting (2 add groups broken per age demo based on initial research), I was also just targeting divorced as I thought that was logical as mostly anyone over 45 that is single is most likely divorced?

CPM $1.00
Freq Cap: 3
Daily Budget: $20.00
Country: United States
Age:Between 45-49 & 50-54
Gender: Female
Login Count: ≤50
Marital Status: Divorced
Session Depth: ≤20
Browser Type: ≠iPhone, Android

payout: $7.30
spend: $58.25
Conversions: 2 (1 from each demo)
Income: $14.6
P/L -75%

These were the stat for for about 4-5 days (1st row 45-49, 2nd row 50-54).

My main concerns were the ctr, the volume.

I’ve tried around 25-30 images of different types, head/body shots, ripped matures, even women ( after adapting the ad copy) but I can’t seem to get the ctr above 0.1?

I will set the campaign live again today and try to make changed based up the advice given here.

Appreciate any comments

User Comment:
You shouldn’t target session depth under 5 for women since they mostly check their mails the first sessions.

User Comment:
^^ What he said. Go for session < 30 to start. Also try divorced and widowed. Gets you a larger group in the same basic demographic.

eta: The reason I don’t recommend doing between 5 and 30 is that some people do log in, see a good ad and click it. Also if you’re using 300×250 banners you’re displaying in the mail window anyway so you don’t want to cut out the time they’re there. I don’t know if you are using them or not but it’s worth noting.

User Comment:
It’s time to split test the bejezzars out of it. Test everything. Then test the stuff you wouldn’t dream of testing in a zillion years. It’ll pop up and bank.

User Comment:
Thanks @tap1onnot not sure what you mean regarding session depth as I’ve set it to <20, but I guess your advising the same as @Z6marketing to up it? will knock it up to <30

As it’s already targeted for divorced, I should also do widowed for sure.

@ppchound, have 2 landing pages running with this…. so split testing on this already though the 2 conversion I have so far have come from the same landing page but 2 different demos. Where do you suppose I start with the split testing? maybe reduce the bid and increase frequency cap to 5?


User Comment:
Start with the headline. NEVER change more than one variable at a time so you can keep track of the changes and the effect on performance.
I use a spreadsheet for this. One row per change noting CTR conversions in the columns as you descend.

Once you have a good headline working change the case/font/colour then start on the sub headline (same as before) then images,buttons positions of the elements. Border/no border, colour, thickness …. you get the drift.

If you want the cheese, you gotta do a few revolutions in the little wheel first The wannabees and posers drop out after only two laps (thank goodness!). Usually with "It’s not working". Yeah, what’s not working? The campaign or YOU? (said in my "You can’t handle the truth" Jack Nicholson voice LOL)

Damn, I’m gnarly today. Lack or tequila will do that to a guy.

User Comment:
I mean that you should do >5 & < 30, because session depth under 5 is usually the females checking their inbox and not looking at the ads.

User Comment:

@tap1on – i mean that you should do >5 & < 30, because session depth under 5 is usually the females checking their inbox and not looking at the ads.

*penny drops*

@ppchound – if you want the cheese, you gotta do a few revolutions in the little wheel first the wannabees and posers drop out after only two laps (thank goodness!). Usually with "it’s not working". Yeah, what’s not working? The campaign or you? (said in my "you can’t handle the truth" jack nicholson voice lol)

ok, know what you’re saying was just looking for a couple of pointers…i’m a northern boy too so got thick skin!

Damn, i’m gnarly today. Lack or tequila will do that to a guy.

User Comment:

@ppchound -If you want the cheese, you gotta do a few revolutions in the little wheel first The wannabees and posers drop out after only two laps (thank goodness!). Usually with "It’s not working". Yeah, what’s not working? The campaign or YOU? (said in my "You can’t handle the truth" Jack Nicholson voice LOL)

Damn, I’m gnarly today. Lack or tequila will do that to a guy.

Not sure what happen there, and can’t edit post either….

but I was going on to say, I know what you’re saying re the little wheel. just looking for a few pointers, that’s all.

I’m a northern Boy too, so have thick skin

User Comment:
Day 2

I took onboard the advice given. however until I can get my ctr up, I wanted to limit my losses, so changed the daily budget to $10.00 per day on each of the campaigns. not sure whether that’s the thing to do.

Demo 1:45-49
Spend: $10.05
Imps: 10048
Clicks: 8
Conv: 8
CTR: .08
LP6: 0
LP7: 0
leads: 0
P/L: 100%

Demo 2: 50-54
Spend: $10.05
Imps: 10046
Clicks: 10
Conv: 9
CTR: .1
LP6: 2
LP7: 2
leads: 0
P/L: 100%

so admittedly it was a bit of a balls up as the changes suggested didn’t get implemented until around 2pm US Pacific due to time difference (UK) and the newly set budget ran out before the end of the day but still this shows that the 50-54 demo has a little more life in it due to the slightly better ctr, and that the landing pages getting clicks despite the fact that the 2 campaigns got similar exposure.

I just wondered given the advice of @PPChound about "split test the bejezzars out of it", is it too early to change another variable to split test?

Any further recommendations would be helpful….

BTW does anyone know what type of images work for female mature demo?


User Comment:
Get the ctr up first by testing, testing, testing images. If you aren’t getting clicks it’s it’s impossible to make decisions on whether your landing page or offer are converting or not.

To keep on top of the budget, run no more than 800 impressions to an ad before killing it. If you’ve got a winner it will have a click by 800 impressions. My personal best is 3 impressions 1 click (trying to get the elusive 1 impression 1 click shot for you guys).

The thing that 100% turned around my success on PoF and took me from $20 dollar profit days to $500 days (that’s a while back now as everyone seems to use PoF as an introduction to IM…. lol) was finally realizing that I can make no assumptions on what images will work. I’ve seen the fattest, ugliest women get clicks and conversions, hot chicks that never getting anywhere, chicks/guys with tons of clicks and no conversions etc…

NEVER assume you’re personal taste of what works, male or female, is going to work in the real world.

Personally, I try to work on a real world scenario – people want to look at a pic and ‘think’ they would be in with chance…. and incidentally, older women DO click on young muscular hunks… In my testing, they don’t go for the mature, friendly looking dudes…

And try women in the females dating ads. The old saying that women look at women and children works in dating as well. They like to check out the competition – (Hey, if she can get a guy, I sure as hell can!) –

First priority has to be to get traffic to the lander and subsequently the offer – you can’t make any decisions on your funnel based on so few clicks. If you can get clicks, then can’t get conversions – then you start looking at step 2 in the funnel. Be ruthless on those ad images – get an image working, then start to split test that image with different ad headlines (personally, I rarely bother split testing ad copy, although I might try a simple split between the lengthy text to a simple line of text saying just (Hot Babes… Sign Up Now! or something similar)

Don’t test more than 5 images at a time. Load a ton of ads up using Mr G’s tool, then pause them all out except 5 you ‘think’ are the best. This way you’ll quickly see if they get a click by 800-1000 impressions. If not, pause and add another – keep going till you start to see he winners and they settle out at .2% or more – if your in a tight niche like you are.

Good luck

User Comment:
Actually, it was 2 impressions, 1 click. Very tight niche, and didn’t work out. Too few impressions across too many targets to make it worth the effort.

Click for screenshot

User Comment:
Thanks Chris! that’s really Top tips, appreciate it and its a good methodical discipline of how to split test images!

Though I’m not new to IM, I am quite new to the paid traffic aspect of it… I thought PoF is a good place to start by what I’ve read.

thanks again, chip in whenever you like

I’ll keep posting.. fingers crossed!

2 impressions 1 click….really impressed if you got a lead from it too!

User Comment:
sorry it’s a little war & peace on this update…

I took on board as much advise as I could and have the following results: i.e. rotation 5 images at a time, changing the session depth and adding separated as well as only divorced

if you recall there were 2 age groups, these are the results of the best performing age group.

impressions: 17713
clicks: 10
ctr: 0.56%
cpc: 1.50
page clicks: 5
leads: 1
income: 7.30
P/L : -51.4%

cost: $29.18
clicks: 30
Ctr: 0.87%
cpc: 1.12
Page clicks: 5
Lead: 1 (7.30)
P/L -74.9%

cost: $30.06
impressions: 30059
clicks: 22
ctr: 0.73%
cpc: 1.37
Click to LP: 11
Leads: 4
income: $29.20
P/L: -0.03

Cost: $10.50
impressions: 10711
clicks: 8
ctr: 0.75%
cpc: 1.31
click LP: 6
Lead: 1
income: 7.30
P/L : -30.4

I think the evidence is from the above that despite being down overall, I’m only a couple of conversions from breaking even, and if I can get the ctr up to a reasonable level I might be able to crack this, I have to say that the above details were for 1 age demo, the other one which the 5 yr age increment up didn’t do anything… so I will ditch that.

it was at this point (on Friday) I hit up [email protected] and asked his advise regarding ctr, he advised research the demo and understand what they want as he thought that my ad copy might be affecting the ctr.

so maybe you in STM world can be kind enough to advise on what’s wrong with the following:

I’m splitting the following:

Its Raining Men – Hallelujah!! : Finding Mr Right is now easier! our #1 Mature dating site is over subscribed with with men in {State:Your State}! – SIGN UP NOW!

Its The Little Things That Count: Yearning for a real relationship? our men are caring, attentive and chivalrous, no games here – SIGN UP NOW!

How Dating Should Be @ {Age:40+}: Join the #1 site for mature dating, we understand your needs, we make finding Mr.Right easy so you can enjoy life-SIGN UP NOW!

What Women Want From A Man: Fun, Reliabilty, Good Humored and a stable longer-term relationship with a man you can trust – FIND YOUR MATCH HERE NOW!

am I over thinking these, should I make them a little more "vanilla"?

thanks for any advise guys!

User Comment:
I REALLY hope that you’re tracking this campaign with something like Prosper202 or CPVLab. Pay attention to when in the day your clicks/conversion occur and then use Tjin’s excellent day-parting script to turn on/off your POF campaigns so that you’re only spending on impressions during the ‘sweet’ spot. We want those costs down and the profits up.

If you’re not tracking at all, kindly slap yourself HARD.

User Comment:
Hey chris_m, if you get a click per impression I’ll polish your shoes for a week

Not sure if this should be in the ‘confessions’ section, but I once had a picture of a guy, who I had photoshop’d a chicks hairstyle onto and it got a TON of clicks. How nut’s is that?

User Comment:
@ppchound – I’m glad you’ve brought that up! currently tracking with propser202. currently day parting (manually) 6pm – 2am eastern. However the real problem I have with prosper is tracking the individual ads!

I have slapped my self several times and I’ve had friends slap me also just for good measure… but despite trying several things, and reading everything there is on the subject, I can’t get individual ad tracking to work, apart from me being a little stupid, I know I’m throwing money away as I can’t see which ads my conversions are coming from despite trying to remedy the situation?

The scenario is that I set my landing pages up with Ctr tard’s rotation page script, so I would have the following example as the url path:
the rotation/offer pages are at

That’s how I know which age group I’m getting the clicks through via the prosper tracking.

Following on from other posts in the STM forum covering this subject, I have tried to append my landing page url with the PoF tokens ex {age:}, {creativeid:} etc.. but none actually record in my reporting.

I then tried this technique…-was-possible/, which means that I was trying to include tokens in the tracking url:
ex:[[subid]]&{creativeid:}=[[c1]]&{age}=[[c2]] in (step #3) & adding the {creativeid:} and {age:} in the c1 & c2 fields in "get links" (step #7), but still to no avail.

So it is timely this has been mentioned, as I was going to pop a post up asking this anyway, before perhaps considering purchasing cpvlab which seems to be better at tracking this type of stuff.

If anyone can chime in an tell me where I’m going completely wrong, I would be very appreciative, as overall I find prosper to be OK, and I’m sure that other people are tracking Pof adds in prosper just fine?

User Comment:
To save yourself from further self-abuse I’d REALLY recommend that you get CPVLab. Get it today. You’ll kiss the screen when you see it do it’s thing.
Sure, it’s not as pretty as Prosper202 right now, but Rob’s working on that in the background together with his army of monkey butlers.

I was a dyed-in-the-wool prosper202 guy until only a few weeks ago. CPVLab has really taken a load off for me and, before typing this post, I set up a new campaign which I decided to split test between direct linking and a landing page. This I did with a single click of my mouse. Apart from placing two pieces of script into my lander, CPVLab took care of the rest for me. Sweet.

Wat to rotate both landers and the offers they go to? Yeah, sure you do. CPVLab will do that too. You can also change the weighting so that if you introduce a new offer against an existing offer, which is already generating income, you can weight the rotation towards the existing offer.

If you search the forum there’s a $50 discount voucher available too (typical STM goodness). I only wish I had an aff link for you to click.

Good luck and happy converting!

User Comment:
OK, so after taking up @ppchound’s suggestions of buying CPVlab I duely did so, and also took another server just for good measure this time my 1st vps as I also currently have a dedi for my SEO sites.

Since the last update, I have been trying to understand CPVLab aswell as been away, so things have pretty much ground to a halt.

I eventually got the campaign back up and running on Thursday 1 sept with following results:

cost: $11.65
clicks: 22
Ctr: 0.153%
cpc: 0.53
Page clicks: 6
Lead: 1 (7.30)
P/L -$4.35
P/L -74.9%

The main thing I found was that using CPVlab was that despite everything else registered OK, the conversions didn’t show? so had to update Subid’s manually (not sure what’s going on there?)

I also placed the POF pixel with the network as the clicks to conversion stats POF were reporting was aof the order of 90% which was plainly wrong. From then on the conversions showing in POF are accurate.

cost: $3.56
clicks: 6
Ctr: 0.131%
cpc: 0.89
Page clicks: 3
Lead: 1 (7.30)
P/L $3.74
P/L 105%

As I was ill (MAN FLU) and could not sleep, I decided to monitor this all night (I’m in the UK so 6-9 hours ahead of the US which is where the offer is running) I found that there was virtually no traffic, the volume had dropped from the previous day, and it was like watching paint dry, though I found myself in profit which made up for a night without sleep.

cost: $4.84
clicks: 6
Ctr: 0.125%
cpc: 1.21
Page clicks: 5
Lead: 3 (7.30)
P/L $17.06
P/L 352%

Saturday was amazing as despite been very little traffic again, my CVR was through the roof (50% from ad to lead) but think it must have been some kind of fluke, but again in some ways shows that WE traffic converts better, but I think I was fighting against the guys with the bigger budgets who must have been buying all the traffic?

cost: $10.94
clicks: 16
Ctr: 0.300%
cpc: 0.68
Page clicks: 5
Lead: 2 (7.30)
P/L $3.66
P/L 33%

Sunday, I tried a different ploy, previously I had been day parting 6pm-2am US Eastern. But as it was Sunday I figured a lot of people on a holiday Sunday may be browsing during the day, so I ran from 10am – 2am and played around with my bids.

I first changed my bid to well over $1.50 to see if that would give me more traffic and amazingly with my first click of the day I got a lead , then nothing for sometime. I then changed my CPM bid to over $2, but that didn’t have a great deal of impact either, though I left it like that until I paused it at 2am.

I didn’t change any other targeting, but found that my CTR more that doubled to 0.30, and as a result my cpc came down to .68, but though I still found traffic slow, overall I ended up paying a little bit more due to the length of time I ran the campaign, but overall in profit for the day.

Still learning the rope regards to CPVlab, BTW, can anyone hazard a guess as to why the conversions aren’t showing? but I’ll report back tomorrow hopefully with Monday’s updates

User Comment:
Just today’s update….

cost: $10.35
clicks: 10
Ctr: 0.204%
cpc: 1.03
Page clicks: 10
Lead: 2 (7.30)
P/L $4.25
P/L 41%

The frustrating thing here is still the volume, Not sure whether this was because of the holiday WE in the US, but I guess I’ll find that out over the coming days, nevertheless its not going to grow significantly. I’m happy with the Click to page ratio and I would say I’m well placed to capture additional profits if volume does come.

I’m testing another age demo along side it, but have no conversions and the ctr is not as strong so overall I’m in a loss making position promoting this offer as a whole.

The only thing I can think of to scale is to try Male demo or/and other age groups….. or maybe another traffic source?

Another thing that is interesting is that I am split testing 2 landing pages, and both are virtually identical in terms of ctr and cvr…, I was thinking of perhaps trying a 3rd landing and tweaking it somewhat, but not sure if its worth it on the volume I’m getting?

conversions still not showing in CPVLab, so again not sure about why that is, maybe some CPVlab experts can chime in?

The Article Published IN 08-15-2011 10:28 AM

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